The Cost of Fatherhood for an American Stay-at-Home Dad in Sweden

Joe lives in Stockholm with his Swedish wife, Astri, and their so-adorable-it’s-ridiculous son, Otto. Since Astri went back to work at her literary agency, Joe has been on full-time pops duty, which he chronicles in adorable weekly vlogs. Recently we sat down to chat about frictionless parenthood, the unique challenges of being a stay-at-home dad, and the nirvana that is Swedish parental leave.

Meghan: Hello, Joe! Is Otto asleep?

Joe: Hi! Yes, he is! He’s been doing really well over the past few weeks — sleeping through the night, etc.

M: That’s so awesome. Well done, parent!

So, I’d love if you could tell me a bit about parenting in Sweden. Let’s start with childcare. What’s the deal?

J: I always joke that it’s a frictionless decision to have children in Sweden. All of the regular concerns that my friends have in the U.S. are simply negated here.

The set up is this: for the first year or year and a half, there is parental leave. This is paid for by the government up to a certain salary threshold. So — everyone gets 80% of their salary, up to around ~3K USD a month.

M: Wait. Wow. Both? Both parents get that? You just…get it?

J: Yup. Parents have roughly 18 months of leave to split between them, but two months are reserved for the father. You have to show that you have been working and prove what your income was. You can be unemployed or a student and still get the benefit, but it is much lower. The tax authority is really strong here and knows everything, so I find that it works usually pretty well — you know, when you don’t think about how much the tax authority knows about you…

So, most parents take the first year to 18 months and then put the child in “dagis,” or daycare, where you can send children after their first birthday.

M: How much does that cost?

J: It is subsidized, not free. You pay based on how much you make in salary. The more you earn, the more you pay in dagis. Interestingly, from an American perspective, private and public dagis are in the same system, so you can choose freely.

Astri and I might pay around $100–120 per month.

M: And they cost the same? Private and public? Is there anything different about the systems?

J: In price, I think it’s slightly different. In quality, private is usually associated with more choice. We are applying to a mix of private and public.

Public dagis is controlled at the city level, so one of the downsides is that there is less personal control. The city changes a policy, the dagis has a new policy. Most people we talk to are fine with that and look at us as being too American for wanting to get so involved — in Sweden, parents seem to like to leave things to the professionals.

We are applying to a “private” dagis that is a collective, so not “private” in the U.S. sense. In this setup, parents are collectively involved in the dagis — cleaning up once a season, and even subbing if the regular teachers are sick.

Stockholm’s population has been exploding in recent years and there seems to be a lot of pressure on the dagis system. Behind our neighborhood they’ve recently built a new neighborhood, and all those people are applying to the dagis’s in our neighborhood, which means the queues can get long.

Applying works like this: you can apply starting when your child is six months old and list priorities. You are then put in a queue for that dagis. Like the Miranda Rights — if you do not get a dagis of your choosing you will be assigned one.

M: Haha. Could Otto potentially be put in one that is very far away? Or are there any “bad” ones? If they all get the same funding, you’d imagine the quality would be similar across the board…

J: Yeah, there are some horror stories about location. Astri visited many when she was on leave and the teachers and vibes are very different. For instance, some have mostly or only teachers that are trained as dagis teachers. Others have only one trained teacher and the rest are like “helpers.” That’s been another issue, the lack of people wanting to do this work due to low pay and social status, apparently.

Also, some dagis have a chef making all the meals, and others have meals delivered pre-made, which doesn’t always look super appetizing. And this is both public and non-public. Finally, there are different environments — some are in a basement, some have nice courtyards or are next to a park. So lots of different factors to consider.

M: What about nannies? Does anyone have one?

J: People do use nannies or au-pairs. These are usually people with means, probably the same demographic that uses them in the U.S. You need the space to be able to house an au-pair full time. I’ve heard of au pairs being paid about $500 per month, but that’s on top of food and housing. Nannies are rare because hourly costs are so high — there is very little low-wage labor in Sweden. Even waiters get five weeks of paid vacation and the same benefits as everyone else.

M: That makes sense. Dagis sounds incredibly inexpensive, though. Like you’d pay that much for your daily doggy daycare in NYC.

J: Haha, yes, as I said: Frictionless. I actually think having a dog in Stockholm is more restrictive than having a baby.

M: Actually, that reminds me of something — is it true that people just leave their babies in strollers outside? Like outside a cafe or something? In a stroller? I read that somewhere.

J: Totally a thing, and I didn’t realize people don’t do it in America until I went back. My mom was horrified. But it’s very common to leave a sleeping baby outside, and then I’ll run in and get a coffee and come out and oops, he’s gone! No, just kidding, no one steals babies.

M: YOUR BABY IS VERY CUTE. If I saw your baby, I’d be tempted.

J: Haha, yeah maybe I should be more careful…

Actually, one cool thing in the dagis system is a new trend called “Ur i Skur,” which is having the kids outside for the majority of the day rain or shine.

M: That’s awesome! Does all that correlate to a more relaxed attitude towards parenting generally, do you think?

J: Oh, yeah. It starts at pregnancy. Astri and I had all these neuroses that we brought from the U.S. All the doctors said everything was fine. I used to joke with Astri that the doctor would say, “C’mon, it’s New Years eve, you can have a little cocaine.”

M: LOLZ.

J: They keep telling you that everything is natural. Not a lot of checkups or ultrasounds. Just one ultrasound actually. And you realize that yeah, it is totally natural, we are not putting a man on the moon.

M: Do you think that attitude is connected to subsidized health care as well? How much does it cost to actually have a baby? I’m assuming you just pay in reindeer dust or something.

J: First you have to trap the reindeer, but then it’s really easy.

It’s a joke how little you pay. I think I paid around $150 for a three night hospital stay and delivery. Astri and I brought a life into the world, had round the clock nurses, our own private room, and ate like kings for three nights.

M: !!!

J: That being said, taxes are high, there is VAT, and my salary is MUCH lower than it would be in the U.S. But THAT being said, my effective income tax rate is kind of the same as in NYC, which makes me really wonder what’s up in the U.S…

M: Well, that’s a nice segue into how you decided to stay at home while Astri worked. Can you talk a little about that?

J: Absolutely. We have our 18 months to split up, and Astri took the first six due to nursing and the like, and now I am taking the next six (or seven if you count July, but working in July in Sweden is like being the last person on Earth, so I’m going back in August).

In our circle of friends, Astri’s leave is considered pretty short. Lots of women take nine months to a year. But Astri started her own company a few years ago, and taking off more than six months is not really possible.

I always thought I would take around six months, but for me, as you can see in the videos, it’s a concept I’m still wrapping my head around. Coming from the U.S., I didn’t grow up with this being a self-evident thing, that the dad would stay home. However, here it is seen as very natural, and actually seems to be very unnatural if you don’t

That being said, I was really excited and scared to do this, and now a few months in, it’s fantastic. It’s incredibly draining and exhausting but fantastic. It’s also an amazing tool for raising awareness.

M: Is it common in Sweden to split the time as you guys have? Like, do you think the Swedes need to be woke the same way the U.S. does in terms of parental balancing and the like?

J: It’s becoming more common. I have a colleague who is a dad who is filling in for me at work while I’m away. He’s coming back from a nine month leave. Lots of people seem to be doing that. However, probably the most common route is that the mother takes 12 months and the dad takes 2–6. Apparently, there’s a policy coming that will mandate fathers to take three months, so the mother can only take 15.

M: I mean, you’d imagine that enforcing paternity leave couldn’t help but level the playing field in a broader economic sense, or at least encourage more awareness of the challenges of being a working mother.

J: There are a lot of studies that Sweden lags behind in female executive leadership, and pointing to parental leave as a culprit. The problem is if you have really generous policies but only the women take them, you aren’t really leveling the playing field. In fact, you are making the women worse off, because now employers know that a 30ish woman will definitely be away from the job for at least a year. So it’s important to level that out, I think.

M: That’s a really interesting point. Did you face any pushback from your employer?

J: My employer has been fantastic. I’m working with an international technology company here in Sweden and the Nordics. They were just happy that I was having a baby and made it extremely smooth.

But that’s how it’s been ever since moving here. I remember in my first job, I was asking to take some days for vacation and I realized in the conversation that people don’t usually ask to take time off, they tell the employer that they are going to be away this day and that day. It’s a different attitude.

M: Were all of these accommodations part of the decision-making process when you guys were talking about where you wanted to make your home? Like did you ever think, Oh, I’d rather raise my kid in America!

(ALTHOUGH WHY WOULD YOU)

(TRUMP)

(HELP)

J: Actually, yeah, it’s a huge reason why we decided to start a family. Having a child in a major metro area (NY or LA) seems really daunting — and very expensive. Here, there’s is really none of that. I have neglected to mention the “child benefit” ~$50 that both Astri and I each get every month until the child is 18 — cuz you know, being a parent is tough!

It’s enough to make you think that we should have, like, 10 kids and really scale this opportunity.

I also personally find it humorous that this country is derided in the U.S. for being so socialist, but in so many ways it’s the most “pro-life” country ever.

M: There’s gotta be something bad about Sweden. Is it expensive? How do the costs of baby accoutrements compare to the U.S. — things like clothes, formula, etc…

J: Clothes, formula, child detritus is all as expensive or more expensive than it is in the U.S. Stockholm as a city is probably more expensive for those type of things than even New York (see: VAT). The difference is health care/school/college is largely paid for. Doctor’s visits are free. I was shocked that a prescription we needed for our baby was free. The pharmacist said: “Thank the leftists!” (rough translation).

M: Well, you’re really not NOT convincing me to move to Sweden.

Questions about child-rearing in Sweden? We’ll try to answer them! You can also follow along with Joe and his adventures here.

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