What Do You Wanna Be When You Grow Up?

by Mike Dang and Logan Sachon

Mike: When I was in S.F., I met some of our readers at a meetup. Two of them had moved to the city three days ago, and one had moved there a week ago. One of them said she wasn’t sure what she was going to do yet, but that she and her boyfriend were subletting a place from AirBnb until they figured it out. It reminded me very much of graduating from college and then deciding to move to a new city without any real plans except: Figure it all out and do something to pay the bills in the meantime.

Logan: That’s so exciting for them. I’m so excited for them. Some of my most vivid memories are the first few days in a new city after a move, everything is new and exciting and ohmygosh-do-I-really-live-here. That excitement and anticipation — I wish I felt like that everyday.

Mike: How did you figure out what you wanted to do? I started working in journalism right after I graduated and have pretty much stuck to that, but you were doing a bunch of other things at first, right?

Logan: I still don’t know what I want to do! I’ve fallen into a bunch of things, yep. I moved to L.A. right after school because some friends invited me, and while I was there I worked a retail job and also interned at a production company because when in Roooome. Then I got a gig as a trend writer (which was, writing with authority about what I saw teenagers wearing), which turned into a job in market research. Then I quit that and was a professional temp for awhile, then I moved to Portland and got a job as a copywriter. Then I became a florist, then I got that personal finance gig where I met you, then we started our site, and now I do this and also work at a restaurant. But I don’t know what’s next. I mean I think about it a lot. Especially here, in New York, I have made some friends that have such specific goals — one friend says with such conviction her goal to write and star in a Tony-award winning musical. And I wonder, do I have a dream like that, that I just haven’t figured out yet? Do you?

Mike: I think it’s perfectly okay not to have some big lofty goal like star in a musical, if you don’t have those kinds of lofty goals. Some people just want to live happily and quiet somewhere. I dream sometimes of becoming a recluse. But yeah, I think I’ve figured it out. What I’ve always wanted to do was make a living by writing, and I’ve been able to do that for some time now. My dream was to be a writer, and I guess I am that, and I guess the goal is to continue doing it and not feeling tired of it. I imagine some day doing some travel writing, writing a book, writing for magazines or whatever future thing people will be using to read stories, but I do imagine myself old, and still writing. So: You don’t know what you want to do. Is writing not what you want to do?

Logan: But there are so many kinds of writing! I used to think I wanted to write profiles of people, long-form stories — that’s what all the interviews I’ve done started out in my head as. But then once I start talking to someone, I really just prefer their own words to mine. So who knows. I’m interested in your dream of being a writer. Where did that come from? What inspired you?

Mike: Well, I just always enjoyed writing, even if I didn’t consider it as something I’d be doing for a living when I became a working adult. In seventh grade, we watched While You Were Sleeping at band camp, and then I wrote a sequel called While You Were Awake in this red spiral notebook I had, and I would read new chapters of it during lunch to friends. The other seventh graders were into that! I was on track to go to either business or law school, but then I took a journalism class my senior year of college, and my professor said, “You are good at this, and should consider an entry-level job as a reporter.” And really, up to that point, no one had ever told me that I was good at a job and should do that job. And it was coming from a really respected working journalist.

My first job was covering Congressional hearings in D.C. and it was hard and low-paid, but I really enjoyed reporting and writing stories, and editing the stories to go live on air. So I just stuck with it, went to grad school to move to New York and make some contacts, and was lucky enough to be able to find work through the recession. So the thing is: I know I like to report and write. It could be about pretty much anything. I never thought I’d ever write about money, and yet here I am. And I think it’s cool that we’re covering the financial space in a unique way. Okay, so back to figuring out what you want to do: If writing is something you want to do, there must be things you like about it. What are those things?

Logan: I love talking to people, interviewing them. I like that I have this great excuse to get people to talk to me about their lives. As for the writing part, I like making people laugh, or when someone is like, omg I feel the same way that you feel, thank you for writing about that, I feel like less of a freak. So okay yes writing is great, I love writing.

Mike: Okay, wait. So does that mean you know what you want to do, and that you have an outlet that allows you to do that?

Logan: No, because what if I really want is to be a dental hygienist, and I just don’t know that yet?

Mike: So you’re not sure you want to be a writer then.

Logan: Well what does “being” a writer mean, anyone can be a writer. We happen to get paid for it right now, but for a specific kind of writing, and the world is turbulent! Abundant with unknowns! The night is dark and full of terrors!

Mike: So I guess what I’ve been trying to get at is that you seem to be in a position a lot of people, or at least, a lot of people who dream of being writers want to be in, which is being part of a website where you have the autonomy to write about whatever you’d like to write about, and are getting paid to do that. It may not be enough for you to not have to work another job at a restaurant, but you’re in a good spot. Anyone can be a writer, but not anyone can make a living doing it. And that’s possible for you, because you’re in a prime position to make a living doing it. So if you don’t want to make a living by writing, then it must be something else. And it’s okay that you don’t know the answer to that, but it seems to me that running a website must be something you want to do if you are doing it.

Logan: Yes, yes. But I’ve sort of always had this idea that I’d find a vocation one day and my life would be complete. I don’t know where I got this idea from! But I’m definitely like, waiting for birds and music and trumpets every morning when I wake up and … write movies? Write TV shows? Become an oil painter? A potter? I don’t know. And I’m not there yet.

Mike: I think only the rarest of birds wake up every morning feeling that way. I think ideally, for you, you’d like to wake up every morning without any sense of urgency — where you could write if you’d like, or just have a cup of coffee and sit on a porch all day reading magazines if you want. Or zone out on TV shows. Or work on a really fun interview. Whatever compelled you that day. I think the thing you’d like to do isn’t structured or rigid. You basically want to be a retired person with money in the bank.

Logan: But isn’t that what we all want? Is there a job where you do that? Because, yes, I want that job.

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